We need your help!!! Where is the Community ?

[rsmithgs]

I'm not going to pretend I know everything thats going on because I don't bbbuuuttt What is stopping RC3 from launching? Is it a list of bugs or a lack of freeze or....?

Many Thanks

[joximu]

http://www.isp-control.net/ispcp/ticket/55

as you can see - its an old "bug". And it's a very complex "bug". That's why I 'd separate the update script from the ispcp 1.0 development.
We need a freeze!

[RatS]

Tell Raphael; I cannot do more than telling him, but he tries to improve and improve and creating even more bugs with it. Is it my job to collect the garbage and fix the new bugs made by Raphael? I'm annoyed about that and don't know why my authority as on of two leaders of this project is not respected as much as it should. On the other hand I cannot lock Raphael out, because he fixed a lot of bugs and I'm sure he will in future. What to do?

I announced a freeze and bug fixing only four month ago, as I set the date of RC3.
Everything was planned, but nothing was working.

In my mind it is necessary to get a stable version (called 1.0) soon to gather more resources (like developers) and to give me time to breath and thinking about the next steps and the new organization of the team.

Can any one help me? I've no more power than talking to him and I've done it several times. He is to enthusiastic for this state of the project. Nevertheless I don't want to lose him.

[rsmithgs]

Raphael seems a good person and I wouldn't want to see him leave or upset.

And from what you have said you dont either Rats.

Everyone likes features though everyone wants a stable product so its a hard one to call.

Obviously you wouldnt want the community to fall apart either, the product is coming along so well.

I would like to propose the following if I may, Freeze ISPCP Omega and seek to make it stable. This will get all those sitting on VHCS to move to ISPCP omega, creating a larger user base, then look at compiling a list of new features for the next release?

I don't feel it's my place to question the developers though, just to offer the help and support I can, whether it is finding bugs or offering anything else that can be offered.

I would like to see ISPCP Omega become the best control panel out there and have tons of functions yet be very stable but my short term concern like many is to commision new servers and not use VHCS.

Also a stable release is a great milestone for any project, it is a point to build and move forward from.

Hope my rambling has made sense and inspired someone I'm sure the community will try to back any action by the development team

[joximu]

Hi Rats
ok, this is a clear point - thanks!

Why not let Raphael - I don't want to loose him neither - develop on a new branch, for eg. ispcp 1.1.0. Then do a good check of the actual release and fix the bugs - the most important. As already written: update script should be postponed - can be an independant script...
We can ask Raphael if there are bugs we cannot fix :-)

Most important: separate the development branch from the release branch.
I think other OS projects do similar things.

For the further development: the devs should keep track of what they changed in the structure (db, config etc) so an update script from 1.0 to 1.1 can be developed more easily...

Joximu

[raphael]

Quote:For the further development: the devs should keep track of what they changed in the structure (db, config etc) so an update script from 1.0 to 1.1 can be developed more easily...

the main problem here is that many thing are being done in a bad way.

One of the main reasons why I keep adding more stuff is because some people need some more basic features which neither VHCS nor ispCP were providing. The lack of these features cause a lot of problems when customers need them but the admin is not able to provide them because of the codebase and structure.

Personally I'm trying to get these tickets done (and probably add support for chrooted cgi's and ssh access, even if not enabled by default):
http://www.isp-control.net/ispcp/ticket/387 : using numeric references is one of the worst things that could have been used; we are not robots, we don't simply remember the name/number relation of the table structures
http://www.isp-control.net/ispcp/ticket/305 : I've already made some progress on it. I could 'fully' fix it by modifying the database structure, do you want me to do it again? sooner or later this will be done
http://www.isp-control.net/ispcp/ticket/296 : fastcgi has some problems, and relying on non-free software is not good either (call it whatever you want, but, have you ever read the reason why it is in non-free?)
http://www.isp-control.net/ispcp/ticket/55 : most of us, including me of course, still use VHCS, this is a must have
http://www.isp-control.net/ispcp/ticket/573 : I've no idea right now on how to "fix" it
http://www.isp-control.net/ispcp/ticket/567 : this is just an example on how much help people provide... it's just about modifying the .tpl file
http://www.isp-control.net/ispcp/ticket/553 : if this really exists (haven't confirmed) this must be fixed
http://www.isp-control.net/ispcp/ticket/555 : haven't checked

other things I want to do:
* write a script that checks some system paths so it is easier to update the ispcp.conf file for other distros (lot of people say they will help with that, but they just don't. I don't blame them it isn't easy)
* try to remove hard coded paths from config files (except ispcp.conf) so it is even easier to update the config files
* write a script that regenerates the config files from the ispcp.conf settings (most settings are only used at ispcp-setup and never used after that)

[joximu]

Hi Raphael

ok, seems to be more a communication thing here :-)
Most of us didn't know exactly what you are going to do next/what's your idea of this...

My opinion: it's not *you* having to fix all that stuff. But as you wrote: it's not easy for others to help... BUT I still think: if we have a stable ispcp on debian, then the following tasks are much less difficult for other people to help: update script & support for other distros.
The update script is important but the stable ispcp is MORE important - and it makes no sense to change the priority....
As already mentioned: I don't migrate all the changes to openSuSE only top detect that a week later I can go through the whole process again.

And: for the bugs you want to fix but have no idea how: this should be "discusssed" in the forum or in the ticketing system.

Cheers
J.

[rsmithgs]

aarrr I've had a look at those links and can see what you mean

Wish I were able to code, I might be more useful then.

OK question, obviously no one wants a half finished product (I often feel that VHCS was such a product) but I know there are a lot of people who need to build new servers and don't want to use VHCS.

So the general advice is dont use ISPCP Omega as is at the moment because its unstable and won't be upgradable. Then we have people who dont want to build new servers using VHCS as a control panel. Soooo (and this is purely a brain storm) is there a prefered commercial product that could be migrated to ISPCP Omega when stable by an easily produced script?

Just showing my concern, obviously there is no community without the developers and they should create what they want but those that want something other then VHCS might start looking elsewhere

[raphael]

Quote:if we have a stable ispcp on debian, then the following tasks are much less difficult for other people to help: update script & support for other distros.

but I want to have all the structure changes done so once we release 1.0.0 any subversion (1.0.1, etc) doesn't introduce any structure change.

but there are some things like mod-cband support that really had to be added, even tough it is not fully integrated. E.g. you set a max bw usage of 100MB for a customer and he uses 50 of those 100MB's by uploading files via FTP; mod-cband isn't aware of this usage and will still think the user is allowed to use 100MB's

there are many minor details that also need to be fixed

[RatS]

The Bugs are sorted as they should be resolved. There are at least 15 Tickets before releasing RC3 - and maybe something not yet discovered is found!
What need to be done is all of those tickets have to be fixed.
The Distro Upgrades and the VHCS -> ispCP and ispCP RC2 -> ispCP RC3 update scripts are the last tickets fixed, if anything is working (we have to test them).

We do not need any new features now and we do not need any enhancements. We can do this afterwards, this is the point I don't agree with Raphael's opinion.